Home > Open Discussions > Transmission Forum > '96 Mopar A604 P0300, Won't move

'96 Mopar A604 P0300, Won't move

  1. Please fill out the following to ask a question.

    MAKE: Chrysler
    MODEL: Town & Country
    YEAR: 1996
    MILES: 181K
    ENGINE: 3.8
    DESCRIBE ISSUE....just bought as project but don't have it home yet. Tranny condemned by PO because it won't move forward or backward, and does make an odd sound when running, but only code is P0300. Seems like it's hitting on all 6 cylinders to me. I was thinking of clearing the code to see if it would move then. Thoughts?
     
  2. IMHO, P0300 should have nothing to do with vehicle not moving. Clearing the code to see if there is still a misfire would be OK to do, but will not make your car move.

    Wait and see what our expert, bp, has to say. He is busy and may not see this for a few days.
     
  3. Will do, thanks,

    MT
     
  4. That P0300 isn't related to it not moving at all. Have you looked at both axles, to make sure one isn't broken? Live-data would be great to use here, if the trans turbine is turning (as shown by live-data) and the VSS isn't showing any speed, then you know the problem is in the trans. And, you can check that all shift solenoids are being commanded correctly
     
  5. Thanks, billr. Haven't looked at the axles; I will do that. I don't believe the live data on my scanner does what you are describing. If the solenoids were not getting their signals, wouldn't that throw a code? P0700? I just ordered a trans pressure gauge on eBay and will walk thru the manual for testing the clutchpack pressures,

    MT
     
  6. Yes, a code would probably be set if commands were sent to the solenoids and the proper voltages weren't connected. However, live-data could tell you if no command was sent at all.

    Have you verified the shift arm on the trans seems to be moving OK? Maybe disconnect the shift cable/rod from that arm and manually put it in the detented position for D, you should be able to feel that if the cable is off. Frankly, though, the presence of "odd sounds" makes me think this isn't just a failure of the shift arm being in the correct positions.

    Usually, there is a lower bell-housing cover that can be removed to allow R&R of the screws holding the torque converter to the flex-plate. I would take that cover off and look for any obvious damage in there.
     
  7. PLZ describe the sound better than just "odd". Is it a whine, a buzzing, grinding, knocking or scraping?

    It would be good to remove the pan first to see if any debris is in there. If you see any debris in the pan, than don't even bother doing the tests for clutch pack pressure. It would be a waste of time.

    This may sound bizarre, but I have seen this before. The bolts that hold flywheel to convertor had sheared off. Had a bad grinding noise. Flywheel was free spinning and not driving the convertor. Easy enough to check. Three 10mm bolts to remove to see if the flywheel is still bolted to the torque. Like I said, not a common occurance, but worth a look.
     
  8. Ha, Bill and I posted at same time, we seem to be thinking along same lines.
     
  9. Another quick check also is to remove the cooler lines to see if the pump is pushing fluid. If no debris is in the pan, no discoloration of fluid such a clutch material, I would remove the valve body and clean it reassemble AND THEN check pressures with your e-bay pressure gauge.

    It is rare to loose all movement and reverse at once without a major component failure such as a convertor failure, or stripped sun gears etc. Most times debris will be apparent. That is why checking fluid quality is essential here. If the fluid is nice and red, no debris, I would tend towards looking for something sticking in the valve body or something to that effect.

    And also as Billr said, it would be so very easy with some live data to see what the input and output sensors are reading. Try jacking the front wheels if this is not a 4wd model, if 4wd, jack all 4, and see if the wheels/drive shafts turn when engaged in drive or reverse. Do they turn?
     
  10. I'll define the sound better when it gets towed to me, hopefully tomorrow. Yes, absolutely I will check those torque converter bolts. I will also pull that linkage loose at the shifter. BTW, assumption going in was this would be my first tranny 'repair'...anything better than that is gravy. Also, this being a '96, on the chance that it's the original tranny, it could also have the inferior underdrive/overdrive pressure plate snap ring and drum. That snapring could have finally snapped,

    MT
     
  11. ok you are on the right track with converter bolts a fast check is take off cooler line and start it if fluid is coming out then the pump is working have seen this a few times like mentioned earlyer a converter input can strip out and give a no movement also internal failer . i want to help but i will be in the woods with a cub scout camp out so i wont be back to check on this till monday sorry all P.S. if you have input speed signal that rules out stripped converter live data would be a big help just saying
     
  12. Ok, got this sick puppy home, had a few moments to play with it. When you put it in either R or D, there is a slight lurch FORWARD but that's it. It doesn't matter how much you rev it USUALLY, although as I listened for the sound I figured since it doesn't move in D, why not get under the hood, rev it, and listen. It started to run over me, but didn't. No one said I was too bright...anyway, I describe the sound as a whirring or whining. I think something is broken, perhaps a hub. I looked at live data and in drive revving engine it shows no RPM. That's about all I can see to do with this scanner. I think a teardown is coming and it should prove very interesting.

    MT
     
  13. Clarify: is that"no RPM" for the engine, or the trans turbine/input?
     
  14. Sorry, there is RPM, no speed. I don't believe I can see trans input activity,

    MT
     
  15. I have a Launch 123 scanner. Perhaps I'm not using all the functions. Trolling around, is it the case that the Launch X431 Creader VII+ and/or VIII can actually read Mopar TCM codes AND CVI? For under $200? Anybody know?

    MT
     
  16. Sorry, one other thing; it rolls in neutral only with the engine off. Engine on in neutral it is locked and won't move.
     
  17. You could try something likehttp://www.scantoolsoftware.com/ this paired with a elm327 dongle/interface. I use this type of software on my PC.

    But still trying to see if I can get some similar software to work on my samsung galaxy tab4 7" tablet and have been looking at the launch 431 V. It uses a andoid based software and basically is a samsung tablet such as mine with dual core cpu, same specs, but with a nifty cover that houses the obd2 connector.

    But the price tag on the 431 is well over what I am used to paying for anything. I usually always pay zero for my software. But finding something for the android platform is proving to be hard to crack open in this OS field. http://www.obd2tool.com/goods-4523-...tooth+Tablet+Full+System+Diagnostic+Tool.html
     
  18. What you can do is buy a elm327 bluetooth/wifi (depends on which tablet or laptop you have) and then try some software out.

    Here is a link to a whole bunch of free software. You can try them out, see which one you like. Many of them are trial versions and you will need to pay a small fee for the full versions which will then allow you to see a greater variety of live data parameters.

    https://www.elmelectronics.com/help/obd/software/?v=3e8d115eb4b3#Android
     
  19. You might be better off with this if your willing to spend a few bones. It does TCM.

    http://www.autointhebox.com/autel-m...abs-airbag-major-electronic-models_p1665.html

    Read the website to see if this is what you need. It seems to be around 155$, but there may be some hidden costs as usual.

    I have worked with multiple scanners, included the launch platforms.I hated the launch scanner for it's slowness, but liked it for the coverage and the OEM capabilties ut had, but WAY to slow. I by far prefer the autel platforms. I am currently using a maxi sys pro platform at work. I love it.

    I know I am off topic here, but yesterday, at work, I was on a Acura MDX tailgate problem. The tailgate would not unlock. Without the scanner in live data mode for the BCM, I would never have seen that the BCM was not seeing the left rear door as unlocked, thus preventing the tailgate to unlock. Even though all the door locks were functioning properly, the BCM was preventing the tailgate to unlock cuz one sensor signal wire was cut. I know this is a older car than the acura I was working on, but I am trying to show the importance of buying something with expanded live data. If you work on cars often, then it is worth the investment.

    If you are just a DIYer, than renting one is usually a better option. But for 150$ for three days, I figure better to buy a OEM bi-directional scanner/software.

    Ok, I think I have said e-nuff.
     
  20. "Sorry, one other thing; it rolls in neutral only with the engine off. Engine on in neutral it is locked and won't move."

    That is a significant clue. It seems like the turbine must be turning (when engine is running), pump is producing pressure, and something is hydraulically "locking"; like clutches are applied to select two gears at once.
     
  21. Thanks for all that info, nickb2. I will look at those options. No idea those little plug-in dongles did much. billr, I think I've heard of that. Worth Googling when I get the chance. Ok, pulled the cooler line at the fitting closest to driver side, and routed a hose into a bottle. Ran the engine for like 45 seconds and put it in D as well as R. I think R has the highest pressure. Wow; got like 3 tablespoons of fluid. That doesn't seem like much. It was a bear to get the hose off; pretty sure it's never been touched. So that's a bit more data.

    Probably nothing but in the power distribution center under the hood the EATX backup relay is missing. I doubt that's much of anything; my Dad's '98 Voyager beater doesn't even have that relay. Tomorrow I'll get under this pig and see if anything bites back,

    MT
     
  22. Drunk on pussy and beer and weird tunes like this.

     
  23. Got under it today, pulled the pan, some shavings on the magnet but this has 186K and I didn't see any chunks of hardware. Pulled the filter, buttoned it back up and re-used the very nasty fluid, and got the same symptoms. So unless the fluid can get so horrible as to prevent normal hydraulics, this thing is coming out.

    Pulled the inspection plate, and verified 2 converter bolts present and tight. So it's not those bolts. Something very loose at pass side front wheel, not sure yet if it's the balljoint or the axle flopping around. Leaning towards axle,

    MT
     
  24. sounds to me like the snap ring in the forward drun or the 2/4 snap ring just saying this cuase you said wound move running in nuetral but willwhen off
     
  25. Thanks, bp042665. Maybe the snap ring for the overdrive/underdrive pressure plate? They didn't correct the major issue there until like mid-97; they were breaking. And this clearly hasn't been apart, so that makes sense. Another forum guy with identical symptoms they seemed to think planets.
     
  26. they still have that problem on this unit and the 42RLE transmission i have seen planet but you normaly find metal chunks in the pan. i have seen a stripped input planet do this also i replace the planet set on every rebuild i do at my shop
     
  27. Okay, no more whining or whirring sound. However, if you take it from idle to a higher rev and listen closely you can hear something, I guess you might say a gear sound, not exactly rattling but perhaps loose, seems to me in the rear geartrain area, but of course that could be me assuming things.
    Got a pressure gauge and tested pressure at the taps:

    Underdrive: 100 psi
    Overdrive: 0
    2-4: 0
    Torque converter off: 90
    Reverse: 160
    L-R: 100

    Proceeding with removal of tranny, should have it out and apart Sunday. Anything jump out at you?

    MT
     
  28. the planet spline can be stripped out or the anus gear broke at the weld
     
  29. Okay, got this thing apart. Rear planet grenaded. So far can't pry the 2-4 hub or the front planet off of the input drum. Currently disassembling the 2-4 and L-R clutch sets to see if anything is reusable. Have no real desire to mess with the rear planet, and have a '98 minivan core with good rear planet. Converter on this one looks like it was swapped out, and pump looks ok, so may use those parts in the other case. Or may start with another boneyard core.

    MT
     
  30. Did my assembly and it will only get R and 1st. Won't upshift. Also the same whining noise that tranny had in the '98 I pulled it out of. I probably should have replaced the front planet; splines were not great but I didn't feel they were stripped. If they aren't grabbing, would I get symptoms like this? Oddly, still no tranny codes in this van, with 2nd faulty tranny.

    MT
     
  31. check for power on the transmission relay and that its working
     
  32. Good call by you...I don't get 12V at pin 4 of the solenoid even with engine running, and tracing it back I don't get it at the relay or at pin 15 of the TCM. This might also explain why there is no CEL/tranny codes. I wonder if the TCM went first, kid was driving around in 1st and didn't know it, blew up the rear planet, etc.
     
  33. glad i could help this is what i do i own a transmission shop
     
  34. Hey could a slightly stipped front planet cause a whine in park and neutral only? If not, what might? Thanks,

    D.
     
  35. the wining noise could be a loose pump gear -converter -bypass valve stuck did you clean the bypass valve and air test it when apart ?
     
  36. This tranny made the same noise when it had a different pump and converter. This is a Frankenstein build...I put a new bypass valve in it. I have no way to air test anything,

    MT
     
  37. im not sure where to go because i cant hear the noise could be in the converter