Honda 2000 Odyssey 0172-0170-1491-030... codes

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#1
This has been going on for a long time. now have 107,000 miles
The DTCs are normally P0172 system too rich (bank 1) (one causing freeze frame) and P0170 Fuel trim (bank 1) and sometimes 1491 EGR valve lift sensor insufficient flow detected If I let it go long enough I start getting codes P0300-04-05-06 misfires detected

When DTCs are set, both the check engine and TCS light come on. I dont know what the TCS light has to do with it. I can usually predict when it is going to come on by the feel of a 3rd to 4th gear shift (or 4th to OD). I dont think it is a tranny issue but the engine seems to be causing a slightly rough shift or jerk. When I drive 50-70 MPH on the highway the codes reset and don't come back on till I do some slow driving.

The engine does not run as smooth as it did 25-50k miles ago. I couldnt hear or feel it running then. Its almost like the engine mount auto damper isnt working. But other than that it runs fine. I have run some injector cleaner thru it and it MAY be running a little smoother but the DTCs are still the same. Occasionally, it takes more cranking to start but I havent associated it with being hot, cold, or anything else.

I have checked the EGR valve. It is clean and it operates. IE, when I put a voltage on the input I get a variation in the resistance out.The EGR mod was done by the dealer at 35,000 mi. I have cleaned the PCV valve, and checked the MAP sensor.

My scantool - Dyno-scan by Auterra - shows O2 B1-S1 varies 0-0.9, O2 B1-S2 varies 0.1-0.9 but is mostly high not up and down much like S1.

Short term fuel trim B1-S1 and B1-S2 track and vary 0 to -24 % - that seems to validate the 170 & 172 codes.

ign timing adv 0 - 35

Dealer said I needed an EGR valve based on the 172 & 170 & maybe 1491 codes, but that appears to function. But he also said I may need an O2 sensor. Not a lot of confidence instilled in that diagnosis.

This is driving me crazy, can anyone put these pieces together and give me a 'cause and their reasoning. I don't want a lot of good parts laying around.

thx
 

2POINTautO

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#2
First thing I would do is get the EGR Ports cleaned, through the entire intake manifold, Honda pattern failure item. The TCS light comes on anytime the Check Engine Light comes on, any trouble code kills the Traction Control System, there is no problem with the TCS.

Toyota kills the TCS when it has an ABS code.

Your misfire codes are 4, 5 and 6. Are these cylinders on the same side of the engine, sorry, my CD disc drive is broken and I cant get into my database. I am not 100%, but I think Honda uses the MAP sensor to detect EGR Flow, if the ECM tells the EGR to open, and there is not a great change in the MAP sensor voltage (smaller than normal loss of vacuum) then a code is set, I tend to blame clogged EGR ports on Hondas first. It is likely that most EGR gasses are going to 4, 5 and 6 leaning out those cylinders, showing that ports going to 1, 2 and 3 are clogged or restricted, this is theoretical of course.

I think your tranny feel is the 4, 5 and 6 misfire. I think you can disable the EGR system and road test your vehicle and I bet the tranny shutter will not come back.
 

jjm

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#3
I don't think it would be much of a stretch comparing the Odyssey to the Edsel. Between sliding door problems, tranny problems, engine problems, premature catalytic converter failures, I can't believe the Odyssey continues to sell as well as it does.

Let's go with a quick check on the easier one P1491- which should be addressed first before diagnosing P0170 and P0172. With the ignition off, disconnect the 6- pin connector on the EGR valve. On the EGR valve side, measure the resistance between pins #1 & #2 and pins #1 & #3 (note position #5 is blank) with a DVM. Resistance should both be under 100 ohms. There are more extensive tests that can be done on the EGR system, which I would recommend an <b><a href="http://www.myaffiliateprogram.com/u/alldata/t.asp?id=1035">AllDataDIY</a></b> for a more detailed walk through.

If the EGR system checks out, you should check your fuel pressure. Should be 43-49 PSI. If it's higher, check the fuel return hoses and lines for kinking or restriction. Also note what happens when you disconnect the hose from the regulator - should increase.

What is your O2 (bank 1 sensor 1) voltage from your scan tool? Start the engine and run it at 3,000 RPM until the cooling fan kicks on. If the O2 sensor voltage stays below 0.3V or above 0.6V, replace the bank 1 sensor 1 O2 sensor.

Check your EVAP system. Ignition off, disconnect the 2-pin electrical connector at the EVAP solenoid, connect a vacuum gauge to EVAP purge valve on the CANISTER side. Start the engine. If there's vacuum showing, replace the EVAP purge valve.

For something like this, I can't underscore how helpful an <b><a href="http://www.myaffiliateprogram.com/u/alldata/t.asp?id=1035">AllDataDIY</a></b> sub is.

If none of this does it, unless I'm missing something, then we've got to consider injector leakage... never fun. Other than that, I'm outta ideas...

Joe

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P

phootbag

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#4
I'm a tech at a Honda dealership. I have seen odysseys come in for EGR low flow codes before. Certain Odysseys should have gotten a stainless steel sleeve installed into the EGR port when it was cleaned. I have seen them come in with plugged ports and NO sleeve even though the service has been performed. This means someone did not do their job. It is possible that the port has clogged itself again. You can lift the intake up yourself. It is actually not that difficult. The EGR port is a lone hole near the throttle body on the underside of the intake plenum. There should be a stainless steel tube installed.

The misfires probably are due to a lean condition due to insufficient EGR flow. The valve is probably operating just fine.