Toyota corolla 2003 no crank.

My Toyota corolla does not crank, when i send power to the red wire in the ignition switch it cranks

  • it does not crank with the key. just klicking relay behind glove box.

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  • where is the starter relay ??

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#31
The fuse box pic...if it is possible to unclip and remove the black wire(without green tracer)? With that wire disconnected, is the fat black wire at ign switch still shorted to ground?

I am wondering if the gray matter close to the black wire/green tracer in the fuse box is meaningful.
 

nickb2

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#32
Yeah Dan, that grey matter is funky. Some sort of infiltration going right into the box very close to affected circuitry.
 

billr

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#33
I hadn't looked at that pic much, lots of "good stuff" going on in there! Burns and broken plastic in several places, tape near that white connector just below the fat BLK/GRN wire, and the YEL wire in that connector looks burned.
 

nickb2

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#34
Yeah, the op took a good high def pic, the close up reveals alot about the state of this fuse box. Looks like some sort of body repair was done and melted the box itself.

Not many options on this car, most cavities are bare. I would definitely remove that fuse box and see whats going on inside and underneath. The weld on the wheel well does not look to be the best weld ever!! If it is a weld. I don't know, but something melted there for sure.

That relay/fuse block is less than pristine. Needs investigating for sure.$.02
 
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#35
Is the BLK still shorted to ground if you disconnect the harness from the switch? Can you extract the pin for the BLK wire from the connector housing?
i cut the fat black wire and applyed 12v to the harness part no short/ ground. I applyed 12v to the fat black wire in the ignition plug and i have a short. I disconnected the plug from the ignition switch and the position in the plug for the fat black wire was ok until i pluged it back in.
I rechecked all power wires in the plug and found that the black /white wire probably shorten out or draws to much amps but its two wires in one position and i can't see on the schematic where the black/white wires go.
when i reconnected everything i checked what happens when i just apply power to the fat black wire and try to crank.
The engine cranks with the key but wont start and only for two or three seconds and than it trips the breaker in my power probe.
I realy think there is a component bad in the black/white wire circuit that leaves the ignition switch.
 
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#36
i cut the fat black wire and applyed 12v to the harness part no short/ ground. I applyed 12v to the fat black wire in the ignition plug and i have a short. I disconnected the plug from the ignition switch and the position in the plug for the fat black wire was ok until i pluged it back in.
I rechecked all power wires in the plug and found that the black /white wire probably shorten out or draws to much amps but its two wires in one position and i can't see on the schematic where the black/white wires go.
when i reconnected everything i checked what happens when i just apply power to the fat black wire and try to crank.
The engine cranks with the key but wont start and only for two or three seconds and than it trips the breaker in my power probe.
I realy think there is a component bad in the black/white wire circuit that leaves the ignition switch.
 

billr

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#37
Have you tried extracting the terminal for the double BLK/WHT wires from the harness connector, then re-connect the harness to the ignition switch and see if it cranks OK, without tripping the probe CB? What is the amperage rating on the probe CB?
 

nickb2

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#38
Can we regroup here and get pin to pin ohm readings and ohm readings to ground?

Rule out wiring before suspecting any components. Wiggle test each harness along the way. I highly suspect a wiring problem way before a ignition switch or relay or starter at this point.

All wiring have been posted, and should be printed out and just follow the yellow brick road, so to speak. Rule out any faulty wiring or connectors at the fuse/relay center and pin test to and from ign switch, and then to and from starter.

A voltmeter does not lie. It is either go or no go. Again, I highly suspect some irish green is doing it's leprechaun dance under there.
 
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#39
Horst said "i cut the fat black wire and applyed 12v to the harness part no short/ ground."

What I really want to know at this point is if the fat black wire has battery voltage AND CURRENT available. I test suspected high-current wires like the fat black one with a headlight bulb. If the bulb burns bright, the circuit is good. if the bulb is dim or will not light, there is a power flow problem. A corroded connection may flow the tiny amount of current needed to show 12 volts on a voltmeter, but the heavy load of a headlight bulb does not lie.

So...my question again...is there plenty of power at the fat black wire at all times? If you have cut the wire you would test the wire part going back to the harness...not the wire part going to the ignition switch.

I had previously suggested that Horst disconnect fat black wire at fuse box under hood. He did not mention if he did that or not. It is very important that we know that bit of information at this point.
 
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#40
Horst said "i cut the fat black wire and applyed 12v to the harness part no short/ ground."

What I really want to know at this point is if the fat black wire has battery voltage AND CURRENT available. I test suspected high-current wires like the fat black one with a headlight bulb. If the bulb burns bright, the circuit is good. if the bulb is dim or will not light, there is a power flow problem. A corroded connection may flow the tiny amount of current needed to show 12 volts on a voltmeter, but the heavy load of a headlight bulb does not lie.

So...my question again...is there plenty of power at the fat black wire at all times? If you have cut the wire you would test the wire part going back to the harness...not the wire part going to the ignition switch.

I had previously suggested that Horst disconnect fat black wire at fuse box under hood. He did not mention if he did that or not. It is very important that we know that bit of information at this point.
I checked the fat black wire. No power.
 

nickb2

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#41
I assume we are talking about the battery power right? It should be hot at all times. And the old headlamp trick is a really good way. I used to carry one in my tool chest until I broke it. Haven't gotten around to scrounging another one. I am too cheap to buy one.:eek::eek::money: I just don't get many of those older sealed beams under my thumb anymore.
 
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#42
I use a 9006 bulb and pigtail
Horst...pretty sure the other end of the fat black wire goes to the underhood fuse box. Better check there for a reason that the fat black wire has no power.
 

nickb2

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#43
Hmm, Yeah Dan, have thought about using those bulbs but seem to always find a way to bust them. I like the old sealed beams.

On another note, I think the op is on the right track.
 
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#44
Horst said "i cut the fat black wire and applyed 12v to the harness part no short/ ground."

What I really want to know at this point is if the fat black wire has battery voltage AND CURRENT available. I test suspected high-current wires like the fat black one with a headlight bulb. If the bulb burns bright, the circuit is good. if the bulb is dim or will not light, there is a power flow problem. A corroded connection may flow the tiny amount of current needed to show 12 volts on a voltmeter, but the heavy load of a headlight bulb does not lie.

So...my question again...is there plenty of power at the fat black wire at all times? If you have cut the wire you would test the wire part going back to the harness...not the wire part going to the ignition switch.

I had previously suggested that Horst disconnect fat black wire at fuse box under hood. He did not mention if he did that or not. It is very important that we know that bit of information at this point.
I cut the black wire like you said the black wire is dead , no current. I than made me a test wire nice and fat with a 30 Amp breaker in it just like on the schematic. Hooked it up to the spot in the ignition switch where the black original one hooks up. i turned the keys to the start position and the engine cranks but wont start. After doing this for a few times i felt that the black/white wire(two wires on one pin) getting so hot that i had to stop. I sat down and looked at the schematic but i cant see where the black/white wires go. Well i have to take that back because one schematic shows that on Black/white wire goes to the fuel pump relay, but the other
black/white one goes to the end of the schematic right top .
i also sprayed some starting fluid in the breather and it did not fire at all, not one little bang, so i assume that i got no spark either.

I also wanted to tell every one of you guys how much i appreciate all the help. I really could not do it without you.
THANK YOU.
 

billr

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#45
OP has said, several times, that it cranks if the RED wire is energized; so I don't suspect the starter/solenoid/relay at all. It's pretty clear Fat Black has no voltage, but does it have continuity to ground? I would like to know about that both ways, with the white 6-pin connector connected to the ignition switch and with it disconnected. I believe the OP has also said attempts to power up the double BLK/WHT wires trips the CB in the power source. What is the rating of that CB? If it is fairly high, like 10-30A, then tripping it indicates a short in the circuits fed by the double BLK/WHT. We probably need a more complete schematic, to start following those wires.