02 Honda Civic P0340

KbarC

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I was told it was originally a P0340 (i can not personally confirm that) Every time it resets a code on me it is a P1362 (no TDC signal)

I have never done a back pressure test. I am assuming we are talking about testing pressure before and after CAT???
 

billr

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OK, it is good to know the only repeatable code now is P1362.

Crap, I just lost a bunch of writing! OK, you only need to check back-pressure before the cat, anywhere after the exhaust manifold. A quick-and-easy test is to remove the pre-cat O2 sensor and run it briefly to see if that makes any difference. Yeah, it will be noisy and you have to watch out that the hot exhaust coming out that port doesn't damage something. Use a temporary heat-shield to divert/block the hot gas, if necessary. You say the engine won't rev over 3500 even unloaded, so you don't have to drive around to do this. You can make it a brief test and keep an eye on things. Even a piece of wood should be OK for a shield...

Nickb2, you used the term "optispark". That is a GM name for a Japanese system that was used briefly by GM. What does Honda call it? Does this engine use a separate module (ICM) where the CKP and CMP signals are decoded, or is the decoding done in the PCM?
 

KbarC

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Thank you, Bill. I will do that first thing in the morning.

Yes that 3000-3500 limit is unloaded after it warms up and sets the code. In the morning it will crank up and drive like a brand new car until it gets to operating temp. As soon as it does, I get the CEL (P1362), lose the rpms and top out at about 20mph. Let it cool down and repeat. I sincerely appreciate the help from you both. If it wasn't in such good shape and run so good otherwise, I would just push it off a cliff. I will post back in the morning
 

billr

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I don't want to BS you, I am not any kind of expert here; I have never even seen your type of engine. All I can offer, really, is general advice.

That live-data is probably going to be vital here. When the engine craps out you need to see which operating parameter has changed considerably or is no longer reading reasonable. Things like MAP, TP, fuel trims or injector PW, spark advance, ECT, IAT, knock retard, cam position, EGR position. it will take too much time and ingenuity to check all those by other means.

While waiting for your ELM327 dongle... you could check fuel pressure, as that is usually not shown in live-data.

And, after it is running poor, have you removed the spark plugs (even one) to see what it looks like? (stark white as opposed to sooty-black)
 

nickb2

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Ok, in 2002, the accord still had the optispark system, not the civic, in 2002 the civic moved to separate. So I may have typed to fast. The hitachi was actually better in design compared to the units with NEC slash toshiba type coil. Sadly, they ALL failed at about 100ish k kms. Honda really tried to fix this issue, it was a plague for client, us techs just had fun, they were super easy to fix and alot of crooked techs made money

The photoelectric type of these engines used to be a big winner for just getting stolen. They went for 600 easy per unit. Of note, mopar also used the optispark system, in the mitsu series engines of this era.

So, I digress now, now we got a code

so op needs to know the car is in limp in mode when it codes the cam position sensor, much like the previous years with the optispark of this ignition system, the ecu used the same algorythm. I think that is what I was trying to say slash type.


Things get a bit confusing after 2000ish. But other hondas still had the TDC sensor in opti spark distributor. Later that year or so later, the TDC sensor moved to front of engine and could be accesd via a hole in plastic cover.

The worst enemy of such a sensor is heat. So actually removing the sensor is quite easy

for op with 2002 civic.png
 
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nickb2

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Often, this design was horrible when a alt or ps belt blew, would hit the pass thru connector. Back then civic were a dime a dozen and always coming in on towing. Great :money: maker for guys like me. I hope that cleared this error of mine, I was off by a year or so.

So if ohming the sensor to ecu wiring reveals good, replace the TDC sensor in front of engine. Limp in mode will go away.

I personally have NEVER ever had to replace a ECU for this. Just the sensor, or the pass thru connector.

I hope this helps and clarifies Billrs question .
 
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nickb2

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I am hugely betting on a weak sensor, but my comment of above should not be overlooked, cuz the pass thru gets loose, especially when you f with it. ;) hint hint:bat:
 

nickb2

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so now I will just go anecdotal since this is a new world I like and just learned that much never ever really changes.

I only ever owned one honda. It was an 88 accord I got for 75dollars off my cousin cuz honda had the great idea to pass gas lines in the car on driver side. He couldnt stand the smelI, good thing it had power windows and a moon roof. I fixed with 2 dollars of tubing, but the smell needed more attention.

What type of engineer thought this idea was a good move IDK, but I drove it till the wheels almost fell off, sold it for 200 and told dude to change the ball-joints. Sadly, he did not, coming back from work one evening, saw my old POS jacked up in a chicken take out place, I did not stop to help, just laughed in my head.

I am a toy guy, I like the yamaha design of the toyota, they are indestructible
 
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KbarC

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I don't want to BS you, I am not any kind of expert here; I have never even seen your type of engine. All I can offer, really, is general advice.

That live-data is probably going to be vital here. When the engine craps out you need to see which operating parameter has changed considerably or is no longer reading reasonable. Things like MAP, TP, fuel trims or injector PW, spark advance, ECT, IAT, knock retard, cam position, EGR position. it will take too much time and ingenuity to check all those by other means.

While waiting for your ELM327 dongle... you could check fuel pressure, as that is usually not shown in live-data.

And, after it is running poor, have you removed the spark plugs (even one) to see what it looks like? (stark white as opposed to sooty-black)
Hey, I am the busted a$$ Honda in the drive asking you for advice so your expertise is above mine and appreciated. I am going to but that ELM327 today and try to get it here as fast as i can.
I will pull that O2 sensor here in a bit and see what happens. Thanks again
 

KbarC

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Nick, yes it is not the old distributor style it is under the top timing cover like the diagram. The plug looks and feels ok. Do you think the brand new sensor is no good? It does the exact same thing at the exact same time as the other.
 

billr

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Is there only a single sensor? My understanding of the GM Optispark, and the Japanese systems it is based on, is that there are two sensors, two trigger patterns on a single cam-driven wheel. And, that is with a simple cam, no VTEC. I would expect VTEC would require an even more fancy pattern.
 

KbarC

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Well, I pulled the O2 and ran it, set an O2code pretty quick but kept running until warm at which time it did the same thing!!!!! (p1362) :confused:
 

nickb2

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@KbarC did you download the pdf

if you could, you need to follow the chart. So now knowing you have a brand new cam sensor in there, and you THINK the pass thru connector is good, follow the wiring.
Is there only a single sensor?
Yes, we have now established that, the op has a TDC sensor no signal code repeatedly, so now, we also know he has a new sensor and now I am just repeating myself.

He needs to check at step six of said above pdf, which he can open with his browser of choice. The feed needs to be checked from PGMFI main relay #1 and dont forget to check ground.

I strongly suggest you freind some dieltric grease in the pass thru connector, if code goes away, you have found the problem. If not, back to step one.

Forget the o2 sensor for now, we are not in weeds yet, just follow the chart, report back, I will advise further. I am just sorry I got confused with the year application, I cant know every thing by heart, cuz if I did, I would be working for nasa right now. :D
 
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