02 Honda Civic P0340

[NickD]

Long thread is P0340 code correct? Sounds like the camshaft sensor is either defective or not getting common, 5, and 12 volt power.

This link show the process to get at it,

For a 2005 but about the same for your 2001, ha, been about 40 years since neoprene timing belts been around, had my fill of them, belts seem to be okay, but the tensioner and idler pulleys have extremely limited lubrication, they seize and the belt breaks, heaven help you if you have an interference engine.

Had problems with Ford variable valve timing circuit, not easy to work on, sure a bunch of stuff on top of the valve cover that has to be removed. The good news about variable valve timing is that the exhaust valves close early leaving burnt fuel exhaust in the chamber.

This eliminates the need for that very troublesome EGR valve that was required ever since they removed lead from gas.

1930's vehicles did not need lead in fuel, was there to prevent detonation and also to reduce combustion chamber temperature from 2,600*F down to a more reasonable 2,000*F. 30's vehicles didn't need lead because the maximum compression ratio was more like 4:1. If your valve timing is slow or your EGR valve quits working will first burn up your exhaust valves then even burn holes in your pistons.

Another example where solving the lead in gas problem that for some passes the brain blood barrier makes them aggressive and stupid, doesn't this sound like our politicians? But also made engine far more complex.

Did not like the way that guy in that video tested the power plug, and one pin hitting ground could short out the power supply and god knows what else.

If you go this far to replace the cam shaft sensor, can also be corroded connectors, replace the timing belt as well, and definitely lubricate or replace the tensioner and if you have one an idler pulley ball bearings. If it says Made in China, pitch those as far as you can throw, caused more grief in the automotive industry then anything else. But maybe not with Japanese vehicles even made in the USA. Japan and China been hating each other since WW II.

88 Supra still has a timing belt, belt, and bearings were all made in the USA, but you really have to search to find them.

Virus culminates all the crap we got from China, they have no natural resources so make their bearings out of recycled throwaway tin cans

 

[NickD]

My old Honda's were non-interference engines, see this changed over the years.

"IMPORTANT: Your 2001-2005 1.7L Honda Civic engine is an interference engine. ... This is good news when it comes to squeezing more performance out of the engine. The downside to an interference engine is that the valves will hit the pistons, when the timing belt breaks, and get bent/damaged."

Another problem with these, that plastic shroud is not air tight, find all kinds of crap in there like shredded mouse part. With a timing chain, sealed and get fresh lubrication with every oil change, still have bean counters, use a stupid slide for tension take up, where a sprocket is far more reliable and efficient.

With a timing belt, no lubrication and debris, really a very stupid idea and interference even worse. Not only bend valves, but ran into cracked aluminum cylinder heads, can even be the block.

 

[nickb2]

Long thread is P0340 code correct? Sounds like the camshaft sensor is either defective or not getting common, 5, and 12 volt power.

I dont know if I should even respond to this.

Yeah long thread. since it is ascertained, the cam senor slash tdc sensor has swapped, crank sensor also.

If you know how to shorten this thread, plz go.

Only thing left to do is wiggle test or swap pcm or pray to some uncertain god.

Shyster I am

 

[NickD]

Due to restrictions, locked up in my home, didn't read all 8 pages, but another possibility and this does happen occasionally with timing belts, can skip a notch affecting camshaft timing.

Only advantage of a timing belt, slightly quieter than a chain. Won't list disadvantages, this thread is already too long.

Ha, where where you 40 years ago? I was having problems with timing belts.

Engines in a FWD vehicle are mounted sideways, many only have an inch clearance between the inner fender, on some to remove the cover, only an inch clearance, can only get an open end wrench in there, quarter turn at a time. While timing marks are very clear in the manual, can't see a darn thing when the engine is in the vehicle.

 

[nickb2]

but another possibility and this does happen occasionally with timing belts, can skip a notch affecting camshaft timing.

Hmm, I dont know, I the think the tdc sensor would still throw a signal even if off synch. I think here, we are seeing car that idles fine until limp in. Not symptomatic of a off t belt or chain even if pcm is auto correcting, it would have thrown a code of crank cam synch and live data also would have checked that or something to that effect.

Unless I am crazy, this is a loss of signal code, not a misfire code which would also accompany your scenario.

Nick, have a great day, it is a challenge for me also to not move, Hang in there.

 

[NickD]

What is a crankshaft or camshaft sensor? First, both are required to replace the distributor ignition system with a brand new name called a distributorless ignition system.

It consists of a permanent magnet about an 1/8" diameter, 3/4" long with a few turns of 36 AWG gauge magnet wire wrapped around it. We were more particular, in putting a thin film of epoxy around it so the magnet wire was not making direct contact with the iron core, and coated it with silastic before placing it in an epoxy mold. Epoxy had a different coefficient of temperature expansion, and without the silastic isolation will break that thin magnet wire.

Lost business to the crooked Chinese, because they skipped this operation.

Operation is simple perpendicular to a round still surface that has a narrow slot machined into it. When away from that slot a magnetic field builds up, but when that slot appears, magnetic field collapses inducing a voltage into that wire coil.

Pulse appears for every revolution for the crank, every other for the cam because of a four cycle engine. Electronics can identify the existence of this plus, but not if its occurring at the wrong time, just a suggestion on that belt skipping a notch.

Had one vehicle where the crankshaft sensor was on a bracket under the harmonic balancer, Suppose to be at TDC, but then the idiots removed the timing marks, that saved them a dime. So using a spark plug with a dowel stuck in the end, could rock the crankshaft in piston #1, mark the two extends and find TDC, and bend that bracket so was reading correctly.

For your information a distrubutorless ignition system is a heck of a lot cheaper than machining a distributor, and also has to be adjusted manually, think about the labor involved.

 

[KbarC]

Ok .... recap of my horrible life......
I was originally told it was a P0340 but i can not personally confirm that. The code it keeps throwing is P1362. Runs fine cold but warms up, throws a P1362 and goes to limp mode.

Cam timing checked and dead on, new cam and crank sensor. Battery power, 5v and good ground at 3pin connector for TDC.
Uninterrupted signal back to pin A26 at ECU even after it acts up. Just swapped with known good ECU and get the same results. Replaced wire from TDC sensor to ECU with same result.

Question now is will anything else on this car throw a cam signal lost code when the cam signal is not lost?????? GRRRRRR

 

[billr]

A couple of questions: Did you replace all three of the wires from the TDC sensor to the PCM? How were you able to swap in that "known good PCM"; did you have to go though the re-flash hoops discussed above to mate it with the BCM and anti-theft systems?

You know that there is some cam signal, but you can't know if it is corrupted without using a scope. Going the scope route is not a trivial adventure, that is why we need to try everything else possible. Have you tried heating/cooling assiduously on the PCM? If so, maybe do the same on the body of the TDC sensor and the CKP sensor. The only reliable clue we have is that it is heat related. Maybe rig a long hose to direct the A/C blow to various places on the engine when it is hot. When the engine is cold, a simple heat-gun (industrial hair dryer...) will do.

I still feel it is possible something else besides the TDC sensor or PCM could cause this code, but no way to really tell without knowing the PCM program. Certainly a bad power or ground wire to the PCM could do it, and those haven't been considered much yet, have they?

Got it? Get back to my heat/cool routine, we need to narrow down where this problem is in just a vague "geographic" way!

 

[KbarC]

Hey Bill. Hope Easter was good.
I still have that dongle thing coming. Hopefully it will be here by tomorrow.
While searching around the internet for a magical answer, I found The PMC with matching ignition lock/immobilizer for a little over 100. I have to assume it is good as the problem is identical to the old one. I put the original back and will resell on EBAY for same price.
I didn't jump power or ground to TDC only signal wire.
I tried the cold air to open board on CPU but not heat. I have not tried temp test at TDC either. I will go do both.

 

[billr]

I agree, it is not likely that the used PCM, regardless of its pedigree, has the exact same weird problem as yours. Try replacing all three wires to the TDC. It is a long-shot, but we are running out of possibilities here. Even if you decide to bite on the scope testing, there will be a considerable learning-curve there, and it could be a tedious process just because of the large number of signals that would need to be looked at. Even if you spring for a scope with four (color) channels it could take a while. You are "blessed", though, with a repeatable and lasting problem. You get reasonable time to look for it, which is not the case with an intermittent!

Again, move temp "testing" all around the engine/car, changing with temp is our best clue. If you can narrow the area being affected by heat down to even just a couple of specific cubic feet, we will be far better able to diagnose. Try heat/cool for several minutes, it takes a while for things to get affected.

 

[NickD]

From Billr, "A couple of questions: Did you replace all three of the wires from the TDC sensor to the PCM?"

If it is a three wire, more than likely its a Hall Effect Transistor, typically common, ECU has its own ground, 5 volts, and output. Heat could saturate that transistor, you need a scope to test it. Japanese don't like to buy crap from China, but China likes to copy good stuff and make crap.

These engine sensors share a lot with ABS sensors in technology.

https://www.rockauto.com/info/182/NTKEC0139__ra_p.jpg

See the prices of this thing are all over the place.

 

[nickb2]

Ok .... recap of my horrible life......

No never

Just 5think

% figure discount

Right now, you are in the right moment.

Awesome news for me good to go,

This one inspires me to do better.

 

[nickb2]

Nothing good comes of it, listen to my nice friends.

 

[nickb2]

These engine sensors share a lot with ABS sensors in technology.

Oh boy, that comment is so going to confuse then what I am about to do.

If ever some one comes here and reads this, a p1362 code or whatever will NOT shut down abs, that is a fact.

If you want to bet go

 

[NickD]

Good grief, talking about magnetic induction sensors, either a coil of wire on a magnetic core or a Hall Effect, this is a transistor sensitive to magnetic flux.

In application each produces a pulsetrain of a rotating device, like a crankshaft or a wheel. If it fails in the engine, get an engine code, if in a wheel get an ABS code.