2001 Chrysler 300M no start

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#1
01 300M 300,000km won't start.
Has code P0601
Has spark, inj pulse, 60psi fuel pressure, 150psi compression and t-belt is ok. Should I change PCM and if so, is it plug and play or do I need a DRB to match vin to BCM?
Any ideas?
 
Joined
Nov 14, 2006
Messages
4,910
Likes
53
Points
48
Age
119
#2
I hate these PCM codes.... the manual gives NO troubleshooting or suggestions.... I will dbl check tomorrow for the need to program PCM... BUT I sure you do at least the SKIM...

Anyway spark pulse and fuel pressure --- have to think of a reason why it won't start...
can you do a reflash?
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#3
Only have a snap on red brick so reflash would be tow to dealer. This one is my second apprentice car, my first apprentice i posted 07 fusion--lol. So i am 400km north on holiday. He has been playing with this for 3 weeks. for giggles, he put in a cam and crank sensor too. Why i dont know, its got spark and pulse.
 

billr

wrench
Staff member
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
6,484
Likes
82
Points
48
#4
Three weeks? Have him disable fuel pump, let it sit for a while, then try starting with a blast of carb-cleaner or starting-fluid. That will confirm that it is "only" a fuel problem, ignition, valves, timing, compression, etc. are all OK. Then the question will be whether it is too lean or too rich, looking at the plugs (after fuel pump enabled again) should help there. Either too rich or lean could be a lot of different things, I always suspect the ECT first, but with an ECM ROM code it's most likely the ECM itself.
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#5
lmao, I know, three weeks. He has to learn somehow. He is learning to stay focused and not get angry when you run into issues.
 

billr

wrench
Staff member
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
6,484
Likes
82
Points
48
#6
That's why I suggested trying a blast of primer fuel, have him learn how it can eliminate a whole lot of things very easily and quickly; before throwing parts at it like the CKP and CMP sensors. Often a spark will "look" OK, but not be. If the engine will fire and run briefly with the primer, then spark is surely good enough to not be the cause of no-start.
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#7
billr,
Good point. I sent him a text and will let you know what happens.
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#8
He gave it a shot of quick start and nothing. No even trying to catch. I wonder, is the pcm faulty making things happen at the wrong time?
 

billr

wrench
Staff member
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
6,484
Likes
82
Points
48
#9
Did he disable the FP and let the engine sit for a while, too make sure it isn't flooded? Primer fuel might not work if the plugs are wet. But, it's sounding like there is no spark. At the start of this thread you said there was spark, how was that determined? Oh, yeah, if he still thinks there is spark, but not at the correct time, he should now learn the joys of a timing light...
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#10
Ok, I checked this myself. Has code Po601 internal pcm fault and a tps low voltage code. Has had P0601 for 3 yrs. TPS working on scanner but full throttle reads 83%. Spark, inj pulse good. cam and crank signals ok and in sync. 12ms inj pulse on roll over and varies 10-16lbs vacuum. Map at 99kpa. Open loop, o2s at 0.49v. Coolant temp sensor reads outside temp.T-belt is on its marks. Pulled out plugs and they were flooded. Cleaned plugs and rolled engine over with no plugs in. Installed plugs, pulled fuel pump fuse and gave a shot of qick start--nothing, not even a sputter. Removed egr to check if it is stuck open-ok. Upper plenum has a lot of sludgey oil in it. PCM??
 

billr

wrench
Staff member
Joined
Mar 12, 2007
Messages
6,484
Likes
82
Points
48
#11
I'll ask again, are you sure there is spark and at the right time? Compression OK? Clarify what you means about 99kPa MAP and 10-16lbs. vacuum. Are those both while cranking (roll over?), is that 10-16lbs. vacuum intake manifold vacuum? That's too much vacuum while cranking, and not consistent with the 99kPA MAP. Almost sounds like there is blockage in the intake system between where MAP is sensed and where vacuum is being read, and that the vacuum gauge is closer to the intake valves... so engine is getting starved of air/fuel mixture when the spray can is used, but being flooded when the port-injectors fire. Ignoring a code, especially one like PCM internal failure, for three years is kind of self-defeating. This apprentice is off to a bad start as a technician!
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#12
Sorry billr,
Baro 99kpa and Map 10-16 cranking. Coil over plug engine--can't really verify spark at the right time. Compression 150 all cyl's. He has no problem spending $$$$ on our fleet but his own car has never seen a dime! Spends all his money on the girls----lol!
 
Joined
Nov 14, 2006
Messages
4,910
Likes
53
Points
48
Age
119
#13
That P0601 is daming... no troubleshooting for it ... BUT as this has been a 3yr issue I agree working around the p0601 might be worth it...
I did NOT see fuel pressure...?
What is the voltage at the MAP & TPS? I ask because the Hg and kPa do not match expecting the same for TPS...
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#14
Fuel pressure is 60psi.
Can't remember voltages off hand.
Let you know when I put upper plenum back on. Took off to check egr---just easier--lol
 

dmk

Sr. Member
Joined
Jan 12, 2008
Messages
151
Likes
0
Points
0
#15
It does have a code for low tps voltage too. Can't remember the dtc# off hand. :(