4L80E Failure after 300 miles!!

cw41

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#1
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MAKE:Chevrolet
MODEL:Silverado 2500HD
YEAR:2003
MILES:106,000
ENGINE
:6.0
DESCRIBE ISSUE....bought a transmission online from what I thought was a reputable tranny specialist in Texas and after 300 miles, the front pump seal pushed out and lost fluid. I had orderded the tranny to shift more on smooth side but it kicked like a mule. When I had my certified mechanic who has installed humdreds of transmissions over two decades remove it, he found indeed the front seal pushed out but why? Why did it shift so hard? He could literally push the seal back into the pump by hand. On inspection of the seal outer surface, none of the orange coating was scarred from what should have been a press fit.
Of note, the transmission and torque converter arrived two weeks apart at my mechanics shop. How can the tranny shop dyno and adjust pressure if necessary without both parts? Maybe so, I don't fully understand can you please answer this for me? Torque converter was supplied by someone other than tranny builder. Upon my mechanics inspection of converter snout, It was found that it was 1/8" longer than it should have been and touching front pump. If both parts were dyno'd together, this would have been found I assume.

Transmission was a custom build for my specific truck, gearing, torque, hp, tire size, etc. I'm out 3800.00 plus labor to my mechanic and tranny builder says 'Improper Installation' upon his inspection when instruction were followed exactly. Tranny didn't overheat fluid is still bright red and paint on converter looks like new out of the box which I'm told on an overheat situation, the paint melting shows signs of overheating.

I paid with a credit card and bank has denied reimbursement. I was reimbursed for the torque converter because I paid with a different card and like I say it was delivered two weeks after receiving tranny.

Thank you in advance to help me understand what might have happened, especially how can a tranny shop dyno without a converter. Any help/advise is highly appreciated.
 
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#2
I am confused "Torque converter was supplied by someone other than tranny builder " so I guess the trans and converter were not mated until installation, both will be pointing fingers at the other.

I am surprised the trans shop will not give any support... did you ask for help- they said no - sight unseen?

the bank denied reimbursement? something sounds wrong, not even a back and forth with you and trans company.
 

billr

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#3
I question whether any commercial trans shops run them on a dyno, I think you are expecting too much there. If it was run on a dyno, I feel certain it would have been furnished with a converter specifically suited to it, and that $3800 (for the whole job) would have been quite a bit more.
 

cw41

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I am confused "Torque converter was supplied by someone other than tranny builder " so I guess the trans and converter were not mated until installation, both will be pointing fingers at the other.

I am surprised the trans shop will not give any support... did you ask for help- they said no - sight unseen?

the bank denied reimbursement? something sounds wrong, not even a back and forth with you and trans company.
Yep converter was supplied buy someone else. Tranny company says its my mechanics failure not his. How can you dyno and check your tranny work when the tranny arrives one day and the converter two weeks later. Then they found the converter nose to be 1/8" too long and rubbing on the pump?? Never heard of that one!! Tranny guy wont do nothing even kept my tranny wont even send it back in the broke state that its in. what a crooked shop!
 

cw41

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#5
I question whether any commercial trans shops run them on a dyno, I think you are expecting too much there. If it was run on a dyno, I feel certain it would have been furnished with a converter specifically suited to it, and that $3800 (for the whole job) would have been quite a bit more.
He gave my mechanic detailed instructions on installation 8 pages worth, then last page states how he dynos all before they leave the shop to make sure no failures. How can you when the tranny and converter ship weeks apart? We got the tranny first, converter 3 wks later? the converter was built for towing, towed 300 miles befor the front seal pushed out. you can put the seal back in by hand and the orange sealant on the front seal looks like it never touched the pump housing no score marks on the seal at all that you would have from a tight fit. thanks
 

billr

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#6
I would like to read more about that "reputable tranny specialist in Texas", would you be willing to state the name? PM me if you don't want to be bad-mouthing somebody in public.
 

nickb2

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#7
From reading this thread, I figure pressure was way to high, hence "kicking like a mule" and the front pump seal could not withstand the pressure. Just a thought. But after reading this thread, I'm confused.



Either I am reading this thread wrong, and honestly, I don't care about banking or credit card statements.

I have to go with Kev2 on this one. Something is not kosher here.

Upon my mechanics inspection of converter snout, It was found that it was 1/8" longer than it should have been and touching front pump
1/8th of an inch is quite big.

Was torque converter end play checked at any time in this process? I can't wait for BP to chime in cuz this makes no sense.

Do you even know if the right converter was installed?

Can you take a picture of your receipts with part numbers from both companies that supplied you?

Also, if you want, provide the VIN#. It will help to know if some parts were interchanged in this dubious project.

I am assuming you have the HD package as you state you are towing. In the snapshots below, are we talking about THIS seal? Screenshot (538).png Screenshot (539).png Screenshot (540).png
 

cw41

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I question whether any commercial trans shops run them on a dyno, I think you are expecting too much there. If it was run on a dyno, I feel certain it would have been furnished with a converter specifically suited to it, and that $3800 (for the whole job) would have been quite a bit more.
I'm trying to pm you billr, cannot get it to do so?? I don't want to badmouth publicly anybody. Are you in texas? Wish I was, I could have a personal meeting with that tranny shop.
 

cw41

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From reading this thread, I figure pressure was way to high, hence "kicking like a mule" and the front pump seal could not withstand the pressure. Just a thought. But after reading this thread, I'm confused.



Either I am reading this thread wrong, and honestly, I don't care about banking or credit card statements.

I have to go with Kev2 on this one. Something is not kosher here.


1/8th of an inch is quite big.

Was torque converter end play checked at any time in this process? I can't wait for BP to chime in cuz this makes no sense.

Do you even know if the right converter was installed?

Can you take a picture of your receipts with part numbers from both companies that supplied you?

Also, if you want, provide the VIN#. It will help to know if some parts were interchanged in this dubious project.

I am assuming you have the HD package as you state you are towing. In the snapshots below, are we talking about THIS seal? View attachment 8510 View attachment 8511 View attachment 8512
this tranny fits a 2003 Silverado 2500hd Its a 4l80e as far as I know. I'll get the VIN later today for you nickb2 thanks for the images but I think it applies to the 4l60e??
Can a tranny shop dyno their tranny product without the proper matching custom built converter that the customer ordered specifically for their application? I cannot see how. I also wonder if this shop sources out their rebuilt front pumps that they use? I'm going to ask them.
 

bp042665

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#12
i have seen this before where the pump face will heat up and the seal blows out but on a dino this doesent happen because there is no engine heat
 

cw41

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#13
Again, check the green circle.
View attachment 8515
Nickb2, the seal in question that pulled or blew out is the front pump shaft seal, the one that usually has a habit of leaking from old age, not from completly being blown from the pump. I have a pic and wish I could send to you but my scan will not forward to email. I can see from the pic that the seals orange surface was not scarred from the interference fit when driving into front pump housing. you can literally put this seal back in by hand it fits that loose. Makes me think that whoever rebuilt the front pump
From reading this thread, I figure pressure was way to high, hence "kicking like a mule" and the front pump seal could not withstand the pressure. Just a thought. But after reading this thread, I'm confused.



Either I am reading this thread wrong, and honestly, I don't care about banking or credit card statements.

I have to go with Kev2 on this one. Something is not kosher here.


1/8th of an inch is quite big.

Was torque converter end play checked at any time in this process? I can't wait for BP to chime in cuz this makes no sense.

Do you even know if the right converter was installed?

Can you take a picture of your receipts with part numbers from both companies that supplied you?

Also, if you want, provide the VIN#. It will help to know if some parts were interchanged in this dubious project.

I am assuming you have the HD package as you state you are towing. In the snapshots below, are we talking about THIS seal? View attachment 8510 View attachment 8511 View attachment 8512

Yes torque converter endplay was checked per the 8 pages of instuctions sent with tranny!